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  • #31
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ID:	1308 Maybe ignorance is bliss but I’ve never followed a route or track via gps so I’m not worried that I have to navigate with waypoints. Right now I’m using CalTopo to add waypoints along the route. I’m building maps for each day on CalTopo and will then download that onto my Garmin device. I can’t speak highly enough about CalTopo. Not only will I have the maps I create on CalTopo downloaded to my garmin devices I will also be able to use CalTopo as a backup standalone off grid navigation device on my phone. My setup on CalTopo is based on the forest service maps with my waypoints.
    Last edited by SeanMacNee; 12-03-2020, 12:13 PM.

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    • Chadzu
      Chadzu commented
      Editing a comment
      At some point during the TOI your bike is almost certainly going to be upside down. Just keep that in mind when you are mounting up your GPS units.

  • #32
    I also plan on downloading “birds eye view” from garmin for spots along the tour that are challenging from a navigation perspective or that I feel would help to have a satellite view in the field. The nice thing about bird eye view is it shows your position on the image so you can tell exactly where you are in relation to the downloaded image.Click image for larger version  Name:	68F2DD9F-3CE9-4E13-80E0-FB58CC61C096.jpeg Views:	0 Size:	585.2 KB ID:	1310
    Last edited by SeanMacNee; 12-03-2020, 12:15 PM.

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    • #33
      I am not worried about having or not having routes either as my navigation has always been on junction turns and target waypoints as well.

      However I do make a full route plan for any new big trips as it gives me distances to key things like gas and food and gives me piece of mind during the ride as to how far to the next major target (or waypoint). I don't know of any way to get a rough estimate of distance to a waypoint or gas location using just way points alone as all the navigate to waypoint options in off road scenarios are as the crow flies which is never accurate and rarely useful unless you are already very close.

      I also don't like the idea that since it seems impossible to enforce that I might simply be kicked of the tour after a lot of hard work simply based on an accusation.

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      • #34
        looking forward to the voyager pro update that will allow importing of user maps as I really prefer navigating with just the MVUM's when in the national forests. They don't have any noise other than giving me trails to choose at junctions. the MVUM's are notoriously inaccurate on the ground so you know not to worry about your exact location on the trail but they are great clean navigation maps for me.

        I know Martin doesn't like the word grit but, last summer for my Grit rides I navigated most of the day on a marked up MVUM. Next summer on the tour I was planning on something similar but with the Challenge Points in my Voyager to have a constant navigate distance to the next point. That would let me see quickly whether it was getting close. Once I arrive at a CP and take my selfie I would switch navigate on for the next CP waypoint.

        I would have to change MVUM maps every time I crossed a ranger district border so the new ability to load them straight on to the Voyager will be awesome next summer. (I didn't have a voyager last summer, I just got it recently for the Tour next year).

        For me Martin's waypoints will be absolutely critical for areas I am not familar with (like the Day 2 desert and the northern later days with sections like Powder Gulch). You ride the trail on the ground in front of you but make sure the way points are your guide.

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        I still like/want to have a route of the day to help me get a big picture sense of the day and to have distances to gas and important waypoints from my current location.
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        Last edited by zzseansmith; 12-03-2020, 02:17 PM.

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        • #35
          I had only just started to map out a track and had only made it to oxford peak, but when he mad the new rules which I thought he said you couldn't use tracks. I may have missed the part about a route's also.

          So I am kind of back on the drawing board. I had already put in my own waypoints especially at junction with trail number. Then putting in a couple here and there between especially the waypoints with bigger gaps. I am using 4 different maps doing this google earth, idaho trail maps, martins national geographic posted maps and arcgis. I am reading the route page, I printed it out to read it and follow on the map that was easier for me I also had to make it a lot bigger to read so now I have 42 pages with no pictures,haha. I save my maps I make in google then put them in basecamp. I like the idea of a waypoint just before a turn to let you know, I am going to check on doing that also, great idea by the way. I also put a camera icon on all the CP photo spots.

          I hope the trail number signs are in good shape when you get to one, I know here in the utah mtns. they are okay sometimes and nonexistant sometimes. I usually have a the forest map when I go sometimes and plus I do have a phone app I use, good sometimes and not sometimes.
          I haven't used my gps for much anything but tracking, I need to get one with a much bigger screen to read. My friend is going to check out a zuma, I think it was, and let me know how it is, we both have about the same bad eyesight.

          How do you like that Montana I see in your picture, that looks nice. I really need to check into upgrading to something like that.
          I was kind of hoping for a black friday or cyber monday deal but I really didn't see any deals on any at the few places I was shopping

          I am researching how many waypoints I can put on a map and load in my garmin now, it's 60csx

          Heres kind of what I got started, some of the trails are on there and some are not, I have idaho topo and us mountain topo.

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          • #36
            Originally posted by msteward View Post
            I had only just started to map out a track and had only made it to oxford peak, but when he mad the new rules which I thought he said you couldn't use tracks. I may have missed the part about a route's also.

            So I am kind of back on the drawing board. I had already put in my own waypoints especially at junction with trail number. Then putting in a couple here and there between especially the waypoints with bigger gaps. I am using 4 different maps doing this google earth, idaho trail maps, martins national geographic posted maps and arcgis. I am reading the route page, I printed it out to read it and follow on the map that was easier for me I also had to make it a lot bigger to read so now I have 42 pages with no pictures,haha. I save my maps I make in google then put them in basecamp. I like the idea of a waypoint just before a turn to let you know, I am going to check on doing that also, great idea by the way. I also put a camera icon on all the CP photo spots.

            I hope the trail number signs are in good shape when you get to one, I know here in the utah mtns. they are okay sometimes and nonexistant sometimes. I usually have a the forest map when I go sometimes and plus I do have a phone app I use, good sometimes and not sometimes.
            I haven't used my gps for much anything but tracking, I need to get one with a much bigger screen to read. My friend is going to check out a zuma, I think it was, and let me know how it is, we both have about the same bad eyesight.

            How do you like that Montana I see in your picture, that looks nice. I really need to check into upgrading to something like that.
            I was kind of hoping for a black friday or cyber monday deal but I really didn't see any deals on any at the few places I was shopping

            I am researching how many waypoints I can put on a map and load in my garmin now, it's 60csx

            Heres kind of what I got started, some of the trails are on there and some are not, I have idaho topo and us mountain topo.
            I like the Montana. It’s also an inreach device so it’s dual purpose. That Zuma looks like a nice piece of equipment too.

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            • #37
              I have found out I can have 50 routes with 250 waypoints each. I have been sort of stitching them together adding my own with trail numbers and road names and some turns markers with hopes that I will be able to figure it out when I actually see them on the trails and roads. With there being well over 200 in the 1st day plus what I have added I am at 271, and only to Lave hot springs. I am going to have to split it up when I get to the end of day one. There are a couple of other days that are 225 and 296 so I will have to really pay attention and split them up also, the rest of the days are pretty low so they shouldn't be a problem I hope.

              From the videos I have been watching they look some what easy to follow in places. One area I did have some trouble finding was the fenceline trail in places and coming up elkhorn. I could see the line from the trail map but there was no trail to be seen, not even just off to the sides or around it, which I found that to be the case a lot while looking at earth and other ariel maps.

              How are the rest of you out of staters doing it and never riden that area before? I have been looking at the montana and zuma and TT, How are you people planning any re routes if you have to get off the main routes and you aren't able to take any of the known routes. I mean what if you need to go a totally unknown way you didn't even think about or looked at. I wouldn't mind trying to find a way to pack some sort of paper maps to look at if the need a rises. Be easier for me instead of looking at my phone or gps's little screens.

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              • #38
                That caltopo is way nice to look at and easy to read I like the looks of it. They are getting ready to change there pricing for there service which one are you using?

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                • #39
                  After many hours of reading and video watching and having a bunch of failures, I have figured some of my problems out with the waypoints. there are 1459 in the whole route, day 2 could be more could be less changing that number.

                  I will share what I have figured out myself. You can have as many POI as you want no limits. I have been able to lay out a whole lot of waypoints along the route and do some coversions and was able to load them in my garmin 60csx and with a few adjustments to the zoom on points I can see all of them, well almost anyways. Some of the ones I had done with trail numbers aren't showing up unless I zoom in to about 120' for some reason but the rest are. the trail numbered waypoints show up still at the .3 zoom but are just a dot, the one I numbered show up with the number.

                  I have ordered up the trail tech and I am really excited to play around with it. Looking at the small screen on the 60 is a little painful, I had to get some cheater glasses.

                  So I have a little tweaking to do but I think I am on the right track. I hope everyone is working on there stuff and if you need more info on my new way of thinking I don't mind sharing.

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                  • #40
                    I am wondering how much of day 2 mapping to do? I think I had seen in a video that martin wasn't going to even give out day 2 till you actually made it through day 1.

                    I notice that on day 2 when you get to the desert that the waypoint numbers jump from 100 to 125.
                    Last edited by msteward; 01-04-2021, 07:23 AM.

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                    • Chadzu
                      Chadzu commented
                      Editing a comment
                      the route into AF hasn't really changed in many years. There are only so many ways to get to Arco from AF. I would be surprised if the cliff dive and BSB were removed from the second half of the day. Martin has promised changes. I think you could probably get a general idea of where you will be going by looking at last years route, but don't get too specific with it.
                      This is how I would do it. I would use last years waypoints as a guide, but change the color or somehow make it clear that they are the old route. Then when the 2021 route becomes available add the '21 waypoints so you can compare. It is a bit early in the year to get to caught up in the exact route.

                  • #41
                    I have seen in one of his videos that it was alright to get started on the route now but there where going to be changes coming. I have been playing with the mapping a lot lately, and seen been watching the videos just as much, well listening more than watching them. And been jotting down any hints I hear.
                    4 gallon tank and bags and trail tech came in this week, wow this tank is big. The trail tech has getting a lot of attention though, I like it so far but has been a bit of learning curve.

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                    • #42
                      Well how many people started watching videos on how to use a compass with a map? I've seen about 5 different ones now and its getting easier.

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                      • #43
                        Question for Garmin users.

                        My primary device will be a trail tech voyager pro, but I just picked up a Garmin GPSMAP 64ST as my backup device. I will have it zoomed in and my voyager at a more zoomed out level during the riding. Th Garmin will also let me put proximity alerts on Challenge Points to warn me to remember to stop and selfie

                        I will record with both and plan on sending Martin the tracks from the Voyager Pro upon a hopefully successful completion of the tour. I have myself a SD Card reader I can connect to my iphone to pull the GPX files from the voyager and email them.

                        However, I can't figure out how to get the GPX recordings from the Garmin without connecting it to a computer to access the files. Has anyone solved or figured out how to get the files to Martin from the field instead of having to make sure I get back to my truck within 72 hours? I can't see a way to move garmin recording track files to its SD Card.

                        Thanks!

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                        • zzseansmith
                          zzseansmith commented
                          Editing a comment
                          looks like you can only pull the recordings with a laptop. https://www.gpscity.com/questions?qid=66220 I will see if the Garmin Explore application and it's ability to sync with Mapshare gives me a path to doing it in the field. Not the end of the world if I can't as I can get the files from the Voyager Pro to Martin immediately and also will be recording with my phone as a 3rd backup. The Garmin recordings would be for the case as a backup to a gap in the recording on the Voyager and phone.

                      • #44
                        If you have a card reader for your phone you can set up gps to save track to card. Then all you have to do is pull out card and use your reader to save it how ever that works. I have never seen a card reader for a phone, thats pretty cool. I just picked up several cards for my TT and 60csx. I will swap as I need.

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                        • #45
                          I would drive around with it while tracking yourself for couple hundred miles then see how much space it used on your card. Then you will have an idea.

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